Login | Register


All times are UTC - 7 hours


It is currently 2019-Sep-17 9:06 am




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 5 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Commander Tournament: casual influenced (bad day for EDH)
AgePosted: 2014-Jul-27 8:43 am 

Joined: 2008-May-15 12:06 pm
Age: Drake
So our shop organized a commander event this summer. Prize support was a bunch of foils and commander cards and 'winner' picks first. Hardly the prize support for competitive players.

We had around 20 players. I guess 30% brought their casual deck and expected such environment.

Most players could play 4 games for the tournament. The end score would be a relative score in the end.
3 points for last man standing
1 point for second last
3 points to kill by combat damage or mill
1 point for other kind of kill (or obvious combo kill (like infinite tokens).

I prepared my deck to be able to fight the competitive decks because I knew they were going to be such decks. Brion stoutarm with lots of hate. I only met 1 combo deck in the 4 rounds and that guy didn't had the chance to play long in our game.
I was also judging the event (2 judges). So I got some feedback afterwards.

Casual players were surprised by the combo decks. We made tables for those players to give them the game they wanted to play. A good call because they were glad they could finish with a more fun game. But some player made it clear: they will never come back.
Some of the players with more competitive decks were also not that happy. They win game one and everyone knew what deck they played. I imagine they got beaten very hard in any other game.

I'm following the competive VS casual discussion for a very long time know. after hard fighting against the competitive growth, I finally accepted it and adapted (in the sence of playing more GY hade, torpor orbs, aven mindcensors,...) I had 15 decks, and now I only have 3 because the others could not compete anymore. My brother is not that fanatic in magic and can't build these decks.

But this event made it very clear for me. Commander is becoming more competitive. If you can't join that, people stop playing. This is sad because competitive means you want to win. And that doesn't work for multiplay because the best player and the best deck is not going to win.
I accepted the theory of (look for similar players), but it's clear that doesn't work. You want to bring your deck friday evening and join other players. Yes, communication is important, but this tournament was meant to be casual. Still we had lots of players with 'unfair' decks.

For me it's clear that things need to change.

I think I will keep 1 casual decks now (comming from 15!) and I built one competitive deck for 1vs1. As a judge, I will try to promote the 1vs1 format. My hope is the competitive decks will evolve to 1vs1 and casual and fun themed decks can reign again in multiplay.


If anyone has feedback about this, please share. What else could we have done to prevent the unhappy ending of this event?

_________________
my EDH decks:
Omnath, locus of mana last updated 22/04/2010
Wrexial, the Risen Deep last updated 22/04/2010
Ob Nixilis, the fallen last update: 07/01/2010
Brion Stoutarm last update: 07/01/10


Experiment Kraj
Stonebrow, Krosan hero


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Commander Tournament: casual influenced (bad day for EDH)
AgePosted: 2014-Jul-27 9:24 am 

Joined: 2012-Jun-07 5:38 pm
Age: Drake
What it sounds like is that those with more competitive decks don't know how to use politics to their advantage. There's nothing wrong with winning and wanting to win, but going for the win as soon as possible is naturally going to draw hate. Be smart, don't play voltron decks against more than 2 other people. And if you're going for combo, slow roll it and use threat assessment. "How much is this going to hurt me if I go all out if there's another game after this or if someone stops me?"

That all comes with experience. I would let these 'competitive players' know this as it is a pretty foreign concept to stall the win and/or use politics


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Commander Tournament: casual influenced (bad day for EDH)
AgePosted: 2014-Jul-27 1:30 pm 

Joined: 2013-Aug-20 4:37 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Boston
pacman wrote:
So our shop organized a commander event this summer. Prize support was a bunch of foils and commander cards and 'winner' picks first. Hardly the prize support for competitive players.

It is surprising how little it takes to bring the cutthroat nature out in some people.

I think that you have two things that you can do to help funnel the competitive and casual groups in different directions:

1) Shift prize support
2) Change point structure

I guess it also is important to do

0) Get 1v1 and multiplayer both going so that you can have different outlets for the different people. You probably want to use the french banned list.

For 1) you can shift the incentives to be less top-heavy for the casual multiplayer, and have at least some of the prizes be participation or "cool play" based.

For 2) your current point structure gives somebody 6 points for a table wiping combo, which won't be good enough to hang with people who are picking up fair wins (at 6, 9, or 12 points), but is definitely better than somebody who is coming in 2nd fairly (getting 1 or 4 most of the time) or 3rd (which is 3 at best). It wouldn't be unreasonable to give both 1st and 2nd at a table a base of 3 points. When one kills the other, that still means that 1st is going to have the kill points from that face-to-face confrontation. This doesn't completely eliminate combo as a method of winning, but it will put them in the middle of the pack unless they manage to run super hot.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Commander Tournament: casual influenced (bad day for EDH)
AgePosted: 2014-Jul-29 3:05 am 
User avatar

Joined: 2009-Aug-20 7:49 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: New Hampshire
JJackson wrote:
1) Shift prize support

Or eliminate. Nothing to win is a great way to tone it down.
JJackson wrote:
2) Change point structure

You can take this further. If combo is really killing your events, you can flat-out ban it, or penalize it so heavily that it's not worth it. No matter what you do, though, someone will be upset about it, so you need to figure out who you're catering to.
pacman wrote:
But this event made it very clear for me. Commander is becoming more competitive.

I don't think this is a fair assessment. If you run an event for prizes, you are going to get cutthroat players. Period. I think you recognize that, but I don't see how you can draw the conclusion. You're bringing an iceberg to the equator, watching it melt, and declaring that the polar ice caps are melting.

_________________
"The President's job - and if someone sufficiently vain and stupid is picked he won't realize this - is not to wield power, but to draw attention away from it." -- Douglas Adams, The Hitchhiker's Guide tot he Galaxy Radio Transcripts predicting the future.


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Commander Tournament: casual influenced (bad day for EDH)
AgePosted: 2014-Jul-31 5:31 am 
User avatar

Joined: 2011-Jan-02 5:25 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Costa La Haya, capital del ducado Holanda
I understand your post, but I don't see what adding graveyard hate has to do with making a deck competitive. Unless you're talking about +10 cards dedicated hate or something. Anyway, I think playing for prizes is dumb to begin with, but if you do: put a penalty in place for combo and multiple turns, that sort of things. A ruleset can decide how people need to play and build their decks (if they want to win on points, that is).

_________________
"Our words are backed with OBLIVION STONE!"


Top
 Offline Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 5 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 7 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 13 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: