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 Post subject: Re: Dream On, Lord Windgrace
AgePosted: 2018-Oct-02 10:13 am 
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Joined: 2011-Feb-07 3:37 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Danbury, CT
Aggro_zombies wrote:
I've found it's really hard to keep the card around for a full turn cycle, though, especially with no counterspells.


Fair. It's one of those cards that's really good against a table of strangers; most people don't cotton on to what it's doing. Much less good against a table of friends though.

Aggro_zombies wrote:
To answer your earlier question, Underrealm Lich might be the better version of that effect. It's tutorable with creature-only tutors, it can dodge "destroy" removal, it beats for a reasonable chunk of damage, and it's less likely to draw the ire of random opponents. It's also probably not that much slower in the midgame.


I suspect Underrealm Lich is the tits.

Doom Whisperer is also terrifying. For a graveyard deck, it's near Yawgmoth's Bargain level of terrifying.

Oraster wrote:
I think you could use some early-game draw effects. It will better fuel your Exploration effects so you can start playing your bigger cards earlier. Phyrexian Arena is an all-star.


Yeah, I added it in when I axed Seismic Assault. It's pretty ok. I think this may be a list where I break down and start adding in more tutors... Life from the Loam really is a key card.

Also, I'm not good at playing this deck yet; I have trouble early on deciding when I should cycle vs. when I should play a card. Hopefully I'll get some more games in tonight.

P.S. Welcome to the forum!

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 Post subject: Re: Dream On, Lord Windgrace
AgePosted: 2018-Nov-29 10:46 am 

Joined: 2017-Jul-06 3:44 pm
Age: Drake
Surprised you aren't running the Squandered Resources + Cadaverous Bloom combo in here with The Gitrog Monster and Lord Windgrace to help get an engine going. Natural Balance also works nicely with that synergy for more board control. Zuran Orb would be a solid include in case you miss any Landfall triggers in the process.

If you're running a high enough basic land count, Destructive Flow literally has no downside to you whatsoever. Since you're already in Golgari there's no excuse not to be running Assassin's Trophy and Abrupt Decay. Worm Harvest helps with your late game while you might also want to look into discarding lands with Skirge Familiar to get back with Lord Windgrace.

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 Post subject: Re: Dream On, Lord Windgrace
AgePosted: 2018-Nov-30 3:11 pm 
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Joined: 2011-Feb-07 3:37 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Danbury, CT
Card Slinger J wrote:
Surprised you aren't running the Squandered Resources + Cadaverous Bloom combo in here with The Gitrog Monster and Lord Windgrace to help get an engine going. Natural Balance also works nicely with that synergy for more board control. Zuran Orb would be a solid include in case you miss any Landfall triggers in the process.


Yeah, I thought about the old ProsBloom combo. I think the Cadaverous Bloom half isn't where I want to be, 'cause I don't want to exile cards... I want to be able to recycle them. I already run Zuran Orb, but I have been thinking about Squandered Resources as another sac outlet for lands.

Natural Balance is an interesting pick. Let me think on it.

Card Slinger J wrote:
If you're running a high enough basic land count, Destructive Flow literally has no downside to you whatsoever. Since you're already in Golgari there's no excuse not to be running Assassin's Trophy and Abrupt Decay. Worm Harvest helps with your late game while you might also want to look into discarding lands with Skirge Familiar to get back with Lord Windgrace.


I think Aggro_Zombies is playing Destructive Flow; he's running a stax-ier build. I suspect it would draw complaints from some folks I play with, so I probably won't add it.

The instants/sorceries are fine in color, however, I'm finding deck space very tight and I don't want to cut too many creatures or cyclers. I'm pretty convinced that I do want the deserts and some of the more mediocre cycling cards, and creature-based removal is easier to reuse.

Skirge Familiar is another interesting idea... AZ was definitely right a few posts ago when he mentioned the list had too many discard outlets, and cutting a couple was a big improvement. Skirge's pretty good with a couple powerful cards like Archfiend of Ifnir and Cut // Ribbons, so I might have to think about it.

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Last edited by Kemev on 2018-Dec-01 1:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Dream On, Lord Windgrace
AgePosted: 2018-Dec-01 4:07 am 

Joined: 2009-Feb-09 4:00 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
I have my current list here.

I've been experimenting with both Decay and Trophy and I like Trophy a lot more. Decay would probably better in competitive metagames but I also don't think Windgrace has legs in that kind of meta. As it is, in your average 75% or casual meta I think there are too many must-kill cards Decay can't hit - stuff like Paradox Engine, Abundance, people's commanders, etc. - that you'd rather have the flexibility.

I like Worm Harvest in general in this deck. The worst case is that it soaks up a bunch of damage aimed at Windgrace every turn.

Familiar and Squandered Resources are probably fine but I think if you want to double down on Gitfrog interactions you should probably just play Gitfrog as the commander. That deck is already very powerful. Windgrace's kit doesn't really lend itself to burst-y power plays like those cards enable, so drawing a Familiar or a Resources without Gitfrog feels pretty underwhelming.

That said, Underrealm Lich plus Gitfrog is nuts and basically insta-wins if you have Borborygmos in play and sufficient mana to flashback Creeping Renaissance.

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 Post subject: Re: Dream On, Lord Windgrace
AgePosted: 2018-Dec-01 2:03 pm 
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Joined: 2011-Feb-07 3:37 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Danbury, CT
Aggro_zombies wrote:
I've been experimenting with both Decay and Trophy and I like Trophy a lot more. Decay would probably better in competitive metagames but I also don't think Windgrace has legs in that kind of meta. As it is, in your average 75% or casual meta I think there are too many must-kill cards Decay can't hit - stuff like Paradox Engine, Abundance, people's commanders, etc. - that you'd rather have the flexibility.


...the other thing I don't like about Trophy is the $. It'll probably never get cheaper, and it's not the most expensive card in the deck by a long shot, but I hate spending money on standard legal cards.

Aggro_zombies wrote:
I like Worm Harvest in general in this deck. The worst case is that it soaks up a bunch of damage aimed at Windgrace every turn.


Depends on how often you see Massacre Wurm. With a few people I play against, there's a chance of falling over dead.

Aggro_zombies wrote:
That said, Underrealm Lich plus Gitfrog is nuts and basically insta-wins if you have Borborygmos in play and sufficient mana to flashback Creeping Renaissance.


I thought Underrealm Lich would be good, and it is way better than I expected. I want to get a Sylvan Library for the deck to abuse the draw-replacement.

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 Post subject: Re: Dream On, Lord Windgrace
AgePosted: 2018-Dec-01 5:38 pm 

Joined: 2009-Feb-09 4:00 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Kemev wrote:
...the other thing I don't like about Trophy is the $. It'll probably never get cheaper, and it's not the most expensive card in the deck by a long shot, but I hate spending money on standard legal cards.

Yeah, fair. Maelstrom Pulse is a fine replacement but I like Krosan Grip slightly more right now.

Kemev wrote:
Depends on how often you see Massacre Wurm. With a few people I play against, there's a chance of falling over dead.

I haven't seen that card in years. Constant Mists instead, I guess?

Kemev wrote:
I thought Underrealm Lich would be good, and it is way better than I expected. I want to get a Sylvan Library for the deck to abuse the draw-replacement.

Lich is the card from GRN I'm highest on right now. I thought it would be solid, but it turns out it's the stone cold nutter butters in every graveyard deck ever.

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Printing generically and boringly powerful cards obviously intended for commander does the format zero favors.

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