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 Post subject: Mind's Dilation
AgePosted: 2016-Jul-06 2:19 am 

Joined: 2016-Jul-05 1:37 pm
Age: Egg
I cannot seem to remember such a splashy EDH card recently printed for Standard. I am super stoked to play this card, but I truly wonder if my friends will hate playing against it. My main concern is that Mind's Dilation bears resemblance towards Prophet of Kruphix and Primeval Titan in which you have single card "combos" that provide an insane amount of resources starting from you first play the card.

On one hand, Mind's Dilation is a seven-mana enchantment, much harder to cast than a green creature. The new mulligan rules also severely hinder the potential for early-game appearances (kudos to the RC on that :)). Still, Mind's Dilation is very difficult for some colors to answer and heavily punishes opponents for playing the game. In a four-man pod, each opponent needs to have a 1/3 deck threat density for you to statistically receive a threat each turn cycle. Combined with the fact that EDH threats generally are those that scale well against multiple opponents, it is not hard to imagine that this card will promptly get out of hand for the table.

I am not calling for the ban of this card. In fact, I harbor a forbidden desire for Wizards to print more busted EDH cards so Prime Time and its ilk can be unbanned one day (probably won't turn out so well :P). I am also trying to avoid looking at this card from a strictly competitive viewpoint like how other players complaining about cards often view them. My question is if the "single-card, resource acquisition" nature of Mind's Dilation is grounds for its potential ban, or there are factors I missed.


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 Post subject: Re: Mind's Dilation
AgePosted: 2016-Jul-06 3:48 am 

Joined: 2011-Aug-18 3:35 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
It's likely not ban worthy but it is obnoxious and will not be fun to play against...


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 Post subject: Re: Mind's Dilation
AgePosted: 2016-Jul-06 3:55 am 

Joined: 2009-Apr-21 3:38 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Palm Springs Area, CA
Or... it might be crazy amounts of fun to play against. Who knows?

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 Post subject: Re: Mind's Dilation
AgePosted: 2016-Jul-06 4:12 am 

Joined: 2011-Aug-18 3:35 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
niheloim wrote:
Or... it might be crazy amounts of fun to play against. Who knows?


Making someone else play your cards and having that be fun would require some actual risk to the thief. The fact that this is a "may" means only the beneficial spells will be cast off this so there's no risk of Phage-ing or Pacting your opponent to punish them for being greedy.

Fun is obviously subjective but certain strategies are pretty much universally despised. This is a card I can say with 100% certainty that I will not ever enjoy playing against.


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 Post subject: Re: Mind's Dilation
AgePosted: 2016-Jul-06 4:15 am 

Joined: 2013-Aug-20 4:37 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Boston
This is very similar to Lurking Predators, which is a card that is strong, but not overwhelmingly so. When you're sinking a mid-game turn's worth of mana into an enchantment that doesn't directly affect the board, it had better have a pretty good indirect effect.


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 Post subject: Re: Mind's Dilation
AgePosted: 2016-Jul-06 4:16 am 

Joined: 2011-Sep-30 6:08 am
Age: Elder Dragon
The card is not broken. It's probably not even that far above average compared to any other 7-mana spell.

It's max once per turn per opponent. You cast stuff from your opponent's deck, not yours, so you can't stack stuff to cast for free. It doesn't hit lands.

Sometimes you will get lucky and get a giant thing. Sometimes your opponent will cast disenchant and reveal a land.

On average, probably less easily broken that something like Future Sight where you get to draw a bunch of spells out of your own deck.

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 Post subject: Re: Mind's Dilation
AgePosted: 2016-Jul-06 4:23 am 
EDH Rules Committee

Joined: 2006-May-18 5:21 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
niheloim wrote:
Or... it might be crazy amounts of fun to play against. Who knows?


I'm betting this. This card seems like crazy fun, and no more broken than Lurking Predators.


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 Post subject: Re: Mind's Dilation
AgePosted: 2016-Jul-06 4:24 am 

Joined: 2009-Apr-21 3:38 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Palm Springs Area, CA
Epsilon wrote:
niheloim wrote:
Or... it might be crazy amounts of fun to play against. Who knows?


Making someone else play your cards and having that be fun would require some actual risk to the thief. The fact that this is a "may" means only the beneficial spells will be cast off this so there's no risk of Phage-ing or Pacting your opponent to punish them for being greedy.

Fun is obviously subjective but certain strategies are pretty much universally despised. This is a card I can say with 100% certainty that I will not ever enjoy playing against.

crap. I missed the may...

yeah this is lame.

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 Post subject: Re: Mind's Dilation
AgePosted: 2016-Jul-07 6:29 am 
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Joined: 2009-Aug-20 7:49 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: New Hampshire
Yeah, that card looks super obnoxious. Not overpowered, but really, really obnoxious.

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 Post subject: Re: Mind's Dilation
AgePosted: 2016-Jul-07 8:17 pm 

Joined: 2013-Oct-09 7:02 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Actually worse than lurking predators. Getting random cards from opponents is more often than not going to be sub-optimal.


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 Post subject: Re: Mind's Dilation
AgePosted: 2016-Jul-08 4:01 am 

Joined: 2013-Aug-20 4:37 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Location: Boston
MrCool wrote:
Actually worse than lurking predators. Getting random cards from opponents is more often than not going to be sub-optimal.

You can hit noncreature spells as well, so you're going to have a higher hit % than LP (unless you built around LP hard, which this doesn't require at all). Only 1 shot per opponent per turn, so that is worse. Personally, I think their power levels are really close and I don't think you can definitively call one or the other worse.


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 Post subject: Re: Mind's Dilation
AgePosted: 2016-Jul-08 5:42 am 

Joined: 2014-Sep-13 7:28 am
Age: Elder Dragon
They are too different to call one better or worse, but in very good-stuff-y metas, Dilation probably will get you 2 random bombs, which is just fine for 7.

It seems like quite a bad card all in all but i would definitely jam it in something.


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 Post subject: Re: Mind's Dilation
AgePosted: 2016-Jul-09 11:02 pm 
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Joined: 2010-Jan-25 4:50 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Mechanically it is similar to Lurking Predators, but to me this is thematically is closer to shared fate. A card which I have always loved. This might push me over the edge to build a Daxos of Meletis or sen triplets deck. They just draw so much hate as commanders, that it's hard to establish a board.

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 Post subject: Re: Mind's Dilation
AgePosted: 2016-Jul-11 2:03 am 

Joined: 2011-Sep-30 6:08 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Daxos draws hate? What kind of crazy metagame do you have?!

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 Post subject: Re: Mind's Dilation
AgePosted: 2016-Jul-11 2:26 am 

Joined: 2011-Aug-18 3:35 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
crokaycete wrote:
Daxos draws hate? What kind of crazy metagame do you have?!


I was thinking the same thing...


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