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 Post subject: A General EDH Survey
AgePosted: 2019-Jun-16 4:26 pm 

Joined: 2019-Jun-06 6:25 am
Age: Drake
I've been conducting a small survey across multiple EDH communities (two discord servers, the largest subreddit, and the general on /tg/, as well as with my local playgroups) to try to gather some data on how the base of EDH players feels about things such as the banlist, the general state of the format, and other aspects of the rules. The survey has gotten 400+ responses so far, and I felt it fair to share it here to gather some of your opinions as well.

Here is a link to the survey.

As some have already pointed out, some of the questions here are clearly flawed (not listing popular options of rule changes as selections, grouping together questions that should be distinct, etc), but I think it's a good stepping stone for future surveys that could be conducted. I'll post the results after at least 1000 responses and when I tidy up the information (gathering together free response answers mostly).

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 Post subject: Re: A General EDH Survey
AgePosted: 2019-Jun-16 10:47 pm 

Joined: 2012-Mar-31 11:52 am
Age: Elder Dragon
I have a general question not at all related to the actual poll (and I'll fully admit that I have spend zero time trying to get the answer myself yet).

How easy was it to create that poll? It looks like you just used your Google account? Any special app you had to install or is it pretty easy to find? When you close the poll are there analytical tools to compile the data for you, or do you have to do everything manually? I ask because I've been running annual polls on MTGS for the pulse of the format but this year I was going to expand it and I was thinking about using Survey Monkey. But if I can do it though Google that would work just as well.


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 Post subject: Re: A General EDH Survey
AgePosted: 2019-Jun-16 11:06 pm 

Joined: 2019-Jun-05 11:49 pm
Age: Drake
This is great. This is an easily accessible way for people to provide feedback which is something that I think could be very beneficial to the format. Nice job

Also Cryogen if you have a Google account you can sign in to Google Drive and access Google Forms, which lets you make surveys like this one.


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 Post subject: Re: A General EDH Survey
AgePosted: 2019-Jun-16 11:46 pm 
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Joined: 2006-Dec-31 12:26 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
cryogen wrote:
How easy was it to create that poll? It looks like you just used your Google account? Any special app you had to install or is it pretty easy to find? When you close the poll are there analytical tools to compile the data for you, or do you have to do everything manually? I ask because I've been running annual polls on MTGS for the pulse of the format but this year I was going to expand it and I was thinking about using Survey Monkey. But if I can do it though Google that would work just as well.


It's pretty easy, I've made a small one before to get answers from my D&D group about style of game and such.

When I go to my Google Drive, I can see the form, as well as the spreadsheet it creates there. The spreadsheet holds all the raw data, so I'm assuming if I delete it, I'll lose all my answers :) But when I click on the form, it goes back into 'edit' mode and I can add/remove/modify the questions there. Along the top there is a 'Responses' tab -- when you click on that, it shows you the responses in various graphs (bar or pie mostly) along with the percentages so you don't need to work any of that out yourself.

And you can set it so a person can only answer once (in which case they can often go and change their answers until it's closed I think), or if they can answer multiple times (for example, if you're collecting ideas on something, letting someone submit multiple ideas can be good -- less graph responses on that though I think...)


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 Post subject: Re: A General EDH Survey
AgePosted: 2019-Jun-17 1:08 am 

Joined: 2012-Mar-31 11:52 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Thanks for the responses. I'll definitely check it out in the future.


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 Post subject: Re: A General EDH Survey
AgePosted: 2019-Jun-17 8:48 am 

Joined: 2012-Apr-11 7:17 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Be sure to remove the entirety of responses from people who want to ban 'island', or the change they want is "N****r'.

I am all for more data, but people have to be attached to their answers, or its a troll-a-palozza

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 Post subject: Re: A General EDH Survey
AgePosted: 2019-Jun-17 10:14 am 

Joined: 2014-Jul-26 11:35 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Response recorded. The only thing I would say is that 3 years is a little short to cut off the options for time played. I've been playing for around 8 years and I feel like I'm still only a teenager/young adult for the format.

I might have used a non-linear scale eg:
less than 1 year
1-2 years
2-5 years
5-10 years
10+ years

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 Post subject: Re: A General EDH Survey
AgePosted: 2019-Jun-17 10:55 am 

Joined: 2012-Mar-31 11:52 am
Age: Elder Dragon
MRHblue wrote:
Be sure to remove the entirety of responses from people who want to ban 'island', or the change they want is "N****r'.

I am all for more data, but people have to be attached to their answers, or its a troll-a-palozza

Good point. If the data remains hidden then I can filter out inappropriate responses, but I will certainly need to play around to make sure I'm comfortable with what I may receive.


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 Post subject: Re: A General EDH Survey
AgePosted: 2019-Jun-17 11:14 am 

Joined: 2014-Jul-26 11:35 am
Age: Elder Dragon
With Google forms you can export them to a excel document, (and/or the google equivalent of an excel document) which means you can sort them based on certain responses and delete the rows that include trollish responses.

That said you have to be careful as a survey designer if you're going to exclude some of your data as that can lead to unintentional bias or reducing the integrity of the results.

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 Post subject: Re: A General EDH Survey
AgePosted: 2019-Jun-17 11:48 am 

Joined: 2019-Jun-06 6:25 am
Age: Drake
MRHblue wrote:
Be sure to remove the entirety of responses from people who want to ban 'island', or the change they want is "N****r'.

I am all for more data, but people have to be attached to their answers, or its a troll-a-palozza

I'd exclude the free response parts for those, but the answers they gave otherwise are not exactly trolling. I'd still include that data. One guy went on a full on rant in the free response section and it was pretty funny to get namecalled for a survey.

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 Post subject: Re: A General EDH Survey
AgePosted: 2019-Jun-17 12:19 pm 

Joined: 2019-Jun-06 6:25 am
Age: Drake
Responses have slowed down drastically, so I'm going to go ahead and compile some of the information. Anyone can look as they see fit here:
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIp ... wanalytics
Interesting things I've noted from this small survey (keep in mind this data is inherently flawed and is more so a representation of the members of the online EDH communities and not every EDH player):
-77.9% of respondents wanted something removed from the banlist
-The three most commonly voted unbans were Primeval Titan, Braids, and Coalition Victory, each having around 25% of respondents wanting them unbanned.
-The most commonly requested bans were Mana Crypt, Sol Ring, Cyclonic Rift, and Protean Hulk
-Some commonly requested rule changes besides bans were a rework of health, a rework of poison counters, a rework on partners, a rework on hybrid mana, a rework of commander damage (either pooling it among all commanders, changing its value, or removing it altogether), planeswalkers as commanders (either all or none, depending on the respondent), and re-instating banned as commander (mostly people voting to unban braids specifically mentioned this)

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 Post subject: Re: A General EDH Survey
AgePosted: 2019-Jun-17 12:30 pm 
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Joined: 2012-Nov-27 4:39 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
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paragon_deku wrote:
Responses have slowed down drastically, so I'm going to go ahead and compile some of the information. Anyone can look as they see fit here:
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIp ... wanalytics
Interesting things I've noted from this small survey (keep in mind this data is inherently flawed and is more so a representation of the members of the online EDH communities and not every EDH player):
-77.9% of respondents wanted something removed from the banlist
-The three most commonly voted unbans were Primeval Titan, Braids, and Coalition Victory, each having around 25% of respondents wanting them unbanned.
-The most commonly requested bans were Mana Crypt, Sol Ring, Cyclonic Rift, and Protean Hulk
-Some commonly requested rule changes besides bans were a rework of health, a rework of poison counters, a rework on partners, a rework on hybrid mana, a rework of commander damage (either pooling it among all commanders, changing its value, or removing it altogether), planeswalkers as commanders (either all or none, depending on the respondent), and re-instating banned as commander (mostly people voting to unban braids specifically mentioned this)

Excluding the three unban focuses, kinda seems players are on whole all over the map on what they want. Which is what I would have guessed.

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 Post subject: Re: A General EDH Survey
AgePosted: 2019-Jun-17 2:05 pm 
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Joined: 2012-Feb-07 4:15 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Primeval Titan is the most requested unban... I don't think there could be a better argument against the format being run democratically. As I've explained in a different thread, it's nearly impossible to overstate how bad that card was the format. And worst of all, it was in a subtle and seemingly innocuous way that's only obvious in hindsight.


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 Post subject: Re: A General EDH Survey
AgePosted: 2019-Jun-17 2:10 pm 

Joined: 2019-Jun-06 6:25 am
Age: Drake
Uktabi_Kong wrote:
Primeval Titan is the most requested unban... I don't think there could be a better argument against the format being run democratically. As I've explained in a different thread, it's nearly impossible to overstate how bad that card was the format. And worst of all, it was in a subtle and seemingly innocuous way that's only obvious in hindsight.

This is a rather silly statement considering that only roughly a quarter of people want it back. That would get shot down in almost any voting system.

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 Post subject: Re: A General EDH Survey
AgePosted: 2019-Jun-17 2:37 pm 

Joined: 2014-Jul-26 11:35 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Not exactly. There is a difference between respondents not selecting prime time for an unban and people voting for a card to remain banned.

The swing voters that dont really care enough either way are unpredictable. Some will favor unbanning in general, or be more recent players who never played with it and vote to unban just to see what happens.

Essentially, as you noted, 25% is interesting, I would say significant. It means that if you polled the same people on the specific question of "Should Prime Time be unbanned" you can guarantee that 25% would vote yes. Of the remaining 75% you only need a third of them to either not care enough or be in favor of unbanning overall to get to the majority.

Survey results are so tricky to analyse, which I spend a significant amount of time trying to teach my students with limited success, so making absolute statements either way should be done cautiously.

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