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 Post subject: Re: A silver border ban list
AgePosted: 2019-Aug-19 7:58 am 
EDH Rules Committee

Joined: 2006-May-18 5:21 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
I don't recall off the top of my head why Magical Hacker was banned, but I think there were a bunch of painful rules interactions with it. That's pretty much where we went to create the banlist for silver-border.

I do not understand what the issue is with fraction cards, and outside of Ashnod's Coupon, the general nuisance cards all seem fine. Allowing silver-borders then banning Mesa Chicken seems like it's missing the point.


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 Post subject: Re: A silver border ban list
AgePosted: 2019-Aug-19 8:35 am 

Joined: 2016-Feb-13 2:14 pm
Age: Dragon
Location: Orlando, Florida
spacemonaut wrote:
When Gotcha comes up, I see people single out Stop That as the one and only acceptable one -- because anyone who's flicking their cards deserves it. :P

I don't think the others are that bad, except maybe Spell Counter.

spacemonaut wrote:
(Of course in EDH there's a political component where one opponent can flick their cards so another can be targeted for discard, but as always everyone involved should be careful about playing too much with fire.)

I've had people try that on me. It's funny until they realize the other players who got hit multiple times from Stop That are now gunning for them.

spacemonaut wrote:
Magical Hacker totally sets us up for awesome, epic, memorable fun games.

I'm thinking now I know why its banned-- planeswalkers. He allows every walker to ultimate as a plus.


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 Post subject: Re: A silver border ban list
AgePosted: 2019-Aug-20 6:41 am 

Joined: 2015-Sep-14 9:53 am
Age: Wyvern
crh1985 wrote:
I don’t have a base problem with contraptions in general, but I was thinking people may make small 5 to 6 card decks so instead of forcing people to have all of them I was thinking of banning the cards

You're required to have a minimum of 15 contraptions in a contraption side deck (in constructed). So the issue you bring up would never even occur.


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 Post subject: Re: A silver border ban list
AgePosted: 2019-Aug-20 7:02 am 

Joined: 2011-Sep-01 5:25 pm
Age: Wyvern
Marit Lage I miss Staying Power and have that and Silence working together
And your right did not think of that about planeswalkers

papa_funk fraction cards where added to make life counting easier, most counters don’t do fractions
And nuisance cards or for small. And shops and GP or other side events
I know people won’t take cards like that out of there deck if it is a bad time or place
Long story short here me and a friend ($4000 in credit card debt) went to a small shop that sold sports memorabilia and magic card my friend used Knight of the Hokey Pokey after I told him to take it out. Of course did the Hokey Pokey hit the table and a $260 poster fall and broke and I had to pay. Then later he got up to try again I grabbed the card and ripped it in 2, sleeve in all
But to some digress I did leave some like Grimlock, Dinobot Leaded and Bog Humbugs
But on a kitchen table or in a large shop with no tournament I see know problems with any or then

MrMoustache I did know know that I’ll look it up when I get time later today. if so I’ll remove them

Fun note
Some fun lyrics for Knight of the Hokey Pokey
Put your left foot in
Your left foot out
Your left foot in
And shake it all about
You do the hokey pokey
And turn yourself around
Just to save my Knight


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 Post subject: Re: A silver border ban list
AgePosted: 2019-Aug-20 7:15 am 
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Joined: 2006-Dec-31 12:26 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
crh1985 wrote:
.. a small shop that sold sports memorabilia and magic card my friend used Knight of the Hokey Pokey after I told him to take it out. Of course did the Hokey Pokey hit the table and a $260 poster fall and broke and I had to pay.

Uhhh what?

1) Why did you have to pay?
2) Why was a poster worth that much? (Idle curiosity)
2b) How does a poster break just by falling? (was it framed, and the frame broke?)
3) Why were you doing physical activity in a physically restricted area?
4) What happened to the poster afterwards?

crh1985 wrote:
Then later he got up to try again I grabbed the card and ripped it in 2, sleeve in all

That.... does seem kinda fair considering how the last one turned out. But that also sounds like your friend is a bit of a jerk: "Oh, I caused you over $250 in fees 'cuz I did something? Lets start doing it again!"


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 Post subject: Re: A silver border ban list
AgePosted: 2019-Aug-20 7:47 am 

Joined: 2011-Sep-01 5:25 pm
Age: Wyvern
1) Why did you have to pay?
At most he has $30 on him and if someone didn’t pay the cop where going to get called

2) Why was a poster worth that much? (Idle curiosity)
It was a old 92 (guessing here) signed Michael Jordan
2b) How does a poster break just by falling? (was it framed, and the frame broke?)
Is was framed in glass not plastic and my friend hit the table HARD it was double latched up do to the weighed and the latched where in the wall and the wire on back was still attached
3) Why were you doing physical activity in a physically restricted area?
Can’t answer that question I don’t know how stupid works ( I told him to take it out)
4) What happened to the poster afterwards?
I threw it out is was in super bad shape and not worth trying to fix and I did not want it anyway

To the other question more stupid then jerk. He is still paying off that debt


But not really the point just saying people will do stupid things at bad times and places


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 Post subject: Re: A silver border ban list
AgePosted: 2019-Aug-20 10:13 pm 

Joined: 2016-Feb-13 2:14 pm
Age: Dragon
Location: Orlando, Florida
Why not just use the list provided by the Rules Committee and add Ol Buzzbark?


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 Post subject: Re: A silver border ban list
AgePosted: 2019-Aug-21 2:08 am 

Joined: 2011-Sep-01 5:25 pm
Age: Wyvern
Marit Lage I did, it is under damage cards. I did not see height when I was reading it the 1st time


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 Post subject: Re: A silver border ban list
AgePosted: 2019-Aug-21 3:03 am 

Joined: 2016-Feb-13 2:14 pm
Age: Dragon
Location: Orlando, Florida
Your revised list seems awfully restricted. I don't agree that cards should be banned for fractional numbers or being annoying. There are hundreds of legal cards that are irritating as hell. Look at Goblin Game, Possibility Storm or Planar Chaos.


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 Post subject: Re: A silver border ban list
AgePosted: 2019-Aug-21 5:25 am 
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Joined: 2016-Nov-27 2:39 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Marit Lage wrote:
Your revised list seems awfully restricted. I don't agree that cards should be banned for fractional numbers or being annoying. There are hundreds of legal cards that are irritating as hell. Look at Goblin Game, Possibility Storm or Planar Chaos.

If I understand correctly this banlist's made for groups who want to use silver border cards but want to play mostly within the ordinary parameters of magic, and don't want anyone (themselves or others) to be prompted by any cards to make a fool out of themselves. So... that's why those are banned I guess.

The "possibly too good" and "possibly better than banned card" sections seem to be additions while they're at it to reign things in. I don't personally agree most of those need to be banned, but if I were to recommend this list to a group I play in, I'd just leave those parts out. For example, Shahrahzad is a nightmare to handle because it almost entirely restarts the game which can take ages -- but The Countdown Is at One starts the subgame at 1 HP and speeds up the entire rest of the outer game. And you're in red. You probably have a Lightning Bolt if you're playing Countdown. The subgame is going to be over very quickly.

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Beloved precons: Atraxa, Praetors' Voice; Saskia the Unyielding; Freyalise, Llanowar's Fury.


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 Post subject: Re: A silver border ban list
AgePosted: 2019-Aug-21 9:42 am 

Joined: 2011-Sep-01 5:25 pm
Age: Wyvern
spacemonaut I was looking for it, but, can’t find it. Commander has a rule against sub game cards and The Countdown Is at One is stupid fast 99.9% of the time, but, it is still a sub game

It might have been changed but I don’t know


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 Post subject: Re: A silver border ban list
AgePosted: 2019-Aug-21 1:12 pm 
EDH Rules Committee

Joined: 2006-May-18 5:21 pm
Age: Elder Dragon
Yeah, I think if you just want "let's get in the cards that aren't wacky", it sort of defeats the purpose (and I say that as a huge fan of silver border). And I'm still trying to wrap my head around Mesa Chicken being unacceptable, but Side to Side is OK.

There's no rule against subgames. There's just no cards that generate them that are legal.


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 Post subject: Re: A silver border ban list
AgePosted: 2019-Aug-21 1:24 pm 

Joined: 2014-Jul-26 11:35 am
Age: Elder Dragon
Sub-game cards are not legal in vintage due to time constraints of tournaments, and since commander uses the starting point of vintage legal cards, they are not legal in commander.

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 Post subject: Re: A silver border ban list
AgePosted: 2019-Aug-22 3:04 am 

Joined: 2011-Sep-01 5:25 pm
Age: Wyvern
papa_funk I’ll make a list to tell you why I put each on the there
Being a general nuisance
Knight of the Hokey Pokey space needed
Mesa Chicken space needed
Bureaucracy the action could be rude or obnoxious in a public area
Ashnod’s Coupon Prototype Portal
Clay Pigeon could injure someone
Emcee “...deep, booming voice...”
Loose Lips the line could be rude or obnoxious in a public area
Working Stiff the people playing around you could get hit by your arm
Red Hot Hottie “...unless you scream...”
Shoe Tree if I need to explain, ask a friend to take off there shoe and smell
Toy Boat I’ll remove this one
Gimme Five people running around to get a high five
Defective Detective asks for help outside of game
Sly Spy (C) (Loses a Finger) sloes down the game if it takes to long to kill
Subcontract asks for help outside of game
Better Than One asks for help outside of game
Kindslaver asks for help outside of game

I left cards like Side Quest, Split Screen, B.F.M. (Big Furry Monster Right), Handcuffs and more do I’m not trying to hinder silver-border card’s fun just trying to keep it safe and non disruptive in a place filled with people or is cramped


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 Post subject: Re: A silver border ban list
AgePosted: 2019-Aug-22 8:19 am 

Joined: 2016-Feb-13 2:14 pm
Age: Dragon
Location: Orlando, Florida
If you're in a cramped place, you shouldn't be paying those cards to begin with. But if you have room, there's no harm in it.


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